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| + | ==Unquantifiable?== |
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| − | {{Stat Block 2 |
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| − | |summary=An unkempt traveling supernatural warrior and exorcist who'll do anything for the right bit of coin. |
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| − | |name=Ian Jackdaw |
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| − | |cr=10 |
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| − | |sex=male|race=human|clvl=[[Grim (3.5e Class)|grim]] 8 |
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| − | |al=CN|size=Medium|type=[[SRD:Undead Type|Undead]] ([[SRD:Incorporeal Subtype|Incorporeal]]) |
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| − | |init=+6|listen=+22|spot=+22 |
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| − | |lang=Common |
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| − | |ac=18|touch=13|flat=16 |
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| − | |acmods=+5 armor ([[SRD:Magic Armor|+1]] [[SRD:Chain Shirt|chain shirt]] of [[SRD:Fortification|light fortification]]), +2 [[SRD:Dexterity|Dexterity]], +1 Deflection |
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| − | |miss=25% chance for normal damage on special attacks due to [[SRD:Fortification|light fortification]]. |
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| − | |hp=52|hd=8 |
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| − | |fort=+2|ref=+4|will=+9 |
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| − | |othsav=+2 on all [[SRD:Saving Throw|saves]] to resist the [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|supernatural]], [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|extraordinary]], [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Spell-Like|spell-like]] or [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Psi-like|psionic]] attacks of [[SRD:Undead Type|undead]] creatures. |
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| − | |spd= 30 ft. (6 squares) in [[SRD:Chain Shirt|chain shirt]], base speed 30 ft. |
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| − | |fly= 30 ft. (perfect maneuverability) |
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| − | |melee1=+1 [[SRD:Bastard Sword|Bastard Sword]] +8/+3 (1d10+2/19–20) |
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| − | |melee2=[[SRD:Sickle|sickle]] +7/+2 (1d6+1) |
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| − | |ranged1=[[SRD:Light Crossbow|light crossbow]] +8/+3 (1d8/19-20) |
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| − | |bab=+6/+1 |grp= +8 |
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| − | |atkop= |
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| − | |sa=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Bane Attack|Bane Attack]] +24 damage (+32 damage while [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|transformed]]) on [[SRD:Full-Round Actions#Full Attack|full attack]] or [[SRD:Action Types|readied action]]. |
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| − | |sdesd=CL 8th |
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| − | |prgrsns={{ |
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| − | Stat Block 2/Spells Prepared |
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| − | |cls=Grim |
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| − | |pd=CL 8th |
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| − | |sp1=''[[SRD:Cause Fear|cause fear]]'', ''[[SRD:Expeditious Retreat|expeditious retreat]]'', ''[[SRD:Obscuring Mist|obscuring mist]]'' ''usable at will'' |
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| − | |sp2=''[[SRD:Blur|blur]]'', ''[[SRD:Death Knell|death knell]]'' ''usable at will while [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|transformed]]'' |
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| − | }} |
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| − | |str=13 |dex=14 |con=12 |int=10 |wis=17 |cha=12 |
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| − | |sq= [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Discount|Discount]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]), [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Favor|Grim Favor]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]), [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Returning Memories|Returning Memories]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]), [[SRD:Turn Resistance|Turn Resistance]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]), Rejuvenation ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]), |
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| − | |feats=[[SRD:Armor Proficiency (Light)|Armor Proficiency (Light)]], [[SRD:Simple Weapon Proficiency|Simple Weapon Proficiency]], [[SRD:Martial Weapon Proficiency|Martial Weapon Proficiency]], [[SRD:Exotic Weapon Proficiency|Exotic Weapon Proficiency]] ([[SRD:Bastard Sword|bastard sword]]), [[SRD:Improved Initiative|Improved Initiative]], [[Bane Attack Focus (3.5e Feat)|Bane Attack Focus]] ×2, [[Bind Possession (3.5e Feat)|Bind Possession]] (his bastard sword) |
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| − | |skills=+12 [[SRD:Concentration Skill|Concentration]] ([[SRD:Constitution|Con]]), +11 [[SRD:Knowledge|Knowledge(religion)]] ([[SRD:Intelligence|Int]]), +10 [[SRD:Hide Skill|Hide]] ([[SRD:Dexterity|Dex]]), +22 [[SRD:Listen Skill|Listen]] ([[SRD:Wisdom|Wis]]), +14 [[SRD:Sense Motive|Sense Motive]] ([[SRD:Wisdom|Wis]]), +8 [[SRD:Search Skill|Search]], ([[SRD:Intelligence|Int]]), +22 [[SRD:Spot Skill|Spot]] ([[SRD:Wisdom|Wis]]) |
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| − | |poss=[[SRD:Ring of Sustenance|ring of sustenance]], [[SRD:Adventuring Gear|backpack]], [[SRD:Adventuring Gear|flint & steel]], [[SRD:Sunrod|sunrod]] ×2, 64 gp |
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| − | |deity=[[Rejik (3.5e Deity)|Rejik]] |
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| − | |san1=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|Grim Transformation]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]) |
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| − | |sad1= A flow of strange ethereal waves flow into his body and weapons. His hair, skin and eyes turn pale. His type changes to [[SRD:Outsider Type|Outsider]]. He can touch any [[SRD:Incorporeal Subtype|incorporeal]] creature as though it were solid, dealing damage normally and ignoring an [[SRD:Incorporeal Subtype|incorporeal]] creature's 50% miss chance. He glides roughly 4 inches over solid ground without touching it. He can pass over [[SRD:Movement, Position, and Distance#Difficult Terrain|difficult terrain]] without suffering penalties to movement. He leaves no tracks behind. He may [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|transform]] at will as a [[SRD:Free Actions|free action]] (as [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Quick Transformation|Quick Transformation]]) on his turn. Ian Jackdaw can transform '''3''' times a day for '''6 rounds''' per transformation.<br/> |
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| − | Ian Jackdaw has the following 4 [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Alteration|Alterations]]: |
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| − | * [[Vigorous Healing (3.5e Grim Alteration)|Vigorous Healing]] and [[Greater Vigorous Healing (3.5e Grim Alteration)|Greater Vigorous Healing]]: Gains fast healing 2 while [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|transformed]]. |
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| − | * [[Stalwart Body (3.5e Grim Alteration)|Stalwart Body]] and [[Greater Stalwart Body (3.5e Grim Alteration)|Greater Stalwart Body]]: Gains damage reduction 4/- while [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|transformed]]. |
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| − | |san2=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Bane Attack|Bane Attack]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]) |
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| − | |sad2= When making a full attack action against his opponents, hey may make a one of those attacks a Bane Attack, dealing +24 damage (+32 damage while [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Transformation|Transformed]]) as magical energies tear through and inundate the target. He may also use his [[Grim (3.5e Class)#Bane Attack|Bane Attack]] as part of a [[SRD:Action Types|readied action]]. |
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| − | |san3=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Discount|Discount]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]) |
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| − | |sad3= He gains a discount on being raised from the dead. The [[SRD:Components (Spell Descriptor)|material component]] cost requirement drops by 40%. |
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| − | |san4=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Grim Favor|Grim Favor]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]) |
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| − | |sad4= He gains a +2 bonus on all [[SRD:Saving Throw|saves]] to resist the [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|supernatural]], [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|extraordinary]], [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Spell-Like|spell-like]] or [[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Psi-like|psionic]] attacks of [[SRD:Undead Type|undead]] creatures. |
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| − | |san5=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Divine Suffusion|Divine Suffusion 1st Level]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]) |
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| − | |sad5=Ian may cast his 1st level spells when not [[#Grim Transformation|Transformed]] at will. |
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| − | |san6=[[Grim (3.5e Class)#Returning Memories|Returning Memories]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]) |
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| − | |sad6= A day after returning from the dead, an epiphany strikes him, and he regains his lost power. If he dies and is brought back to life with a means that would cause him to lose a level, he instead only suffers [[SRD:Energy Drain, Negative Levels, and Level Loss|temporary level drain]] as if he had been [[SRD:Energy Drained|energy drained]]. The [[SRD:Energy Drain, Negative Levels, and Level Loss|negative level]] is automatically restored after 24 hours and never becomes permanent level loss. |
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| − | |san7=[[Bind Possession (3.5e Feat)|Bind Possession]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]) |
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| − | |sad7= He may, as a [[SRD:Free Actions|free action]] when held, retrieve or send his bastard sword to a hidden pocket dimension. If Ian and the item are on the same plane, and the item is not in the possession of another creature, he may call it to himself. The item winks out and returns to his hands instantly. If his hands are full or otherwise unable to grasp the item, it falls to his feet. If the item is in the possession of another creature, he may make an opposed level check (1d20 + his HD) as a [[SRD:Swift Actions|swift action]] to wrest the item from its possessor. If he is successful, the item winks out and returns to his hands instantly. |
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| − | |san8=[[SRD:Turn Resistance|Turn Resistance]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Extraordinary|Ex]]) |
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| − | |sad8=A ghost has +4 turn resistance. |
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| − | |san9=Rejuvenation ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]) |
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| − | |sad9=In most cases, it’s difficult to destroy a ghost through simple combat: The “destroyed” spirit will often restore itself in 2d4 days. Even the most powerful spells are usually only temporary solutions. A ghost that would otherwise be destroyed returns to its old haunts with a successful level check (1d20 + ghost’s [[SRD:Hit Dice|HD]]) against [[SRD:DC|DC]] 16. As a rule, the only way to get rid of a ghost for sure is to determine the reason for its existence and set right whatever prevents it from resting in peace. The exact means varies with each spirit and may require a good deal of research. |
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| − | }} |
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| + | I don't get it, this feat is pretty clean and clear cut: it give your weapon the aptitude property. Why is it labelled as "unquantifiable"? --[[User:Mock Turtle|Mock Turtle]] 19:00, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | '''[[SRD:Attack (Creature Statistic)|Attack:]]''' Ian Jackdaw's ghost retains all his attacks, although those relying on physical contact do not affect creatures that are not ethereal. |
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| + | :Because the aptitude quality in itself, I would surmise, is unquantifiable (at least in the tagger's eyes). Looking at it, I can understand that to some extent. Also, if you'll look at the edit summary: |
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| − | '''Damage:''' Against ethereal creatures, Ian Jackdaw's ghost uses his base damage values. Against nonethereal creatures, Ian Jackdaw's ghost usually cannot deal physical damage at all but can use its special attacks, if any, when he manifests (see below). |
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| + | {{quote|Added balance point - depends completely on which other feats you have|orig=Ghostwheel}} |
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| − | '''[[SRD:Special Attacks and Special Qualities (Creature Statistic)|Special Attacks:]]''' Ian Jackdaw's ghost retains all his special attacks, although those relying on physical contact do not affect nonethereal creatures. Ian Jackdaw's ghost also gains a manifestation ability plus three other special attacks as described below. The save [[SRD:DC|DC]] against a special attack is equal to 10 + 1/2 ghost’s [[SRD:Hit Dice|HD]] + ghost’s [[SRD:Charisma|Cha]] modifier unless otherwise noted. |
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| + | :If you disagree, feel free to expand on your previous question. -- [[User:Jota II|Jota]] 19:55, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | ''Manifestation ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]):'' Every ghost has this ability. A ghost dwells on the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]] and, as an ethereal creature, it cannot affect or be affected by anything in the material world. When a ghost manifests, it partly enters the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]] and becomes visible but [[SRD:Incorporeal|incorporeal]] on the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]]. A manifested ghost can be harmed only by other [[SRD:Incorporeal|incorporeal]] creatures, [[SRD:Magic Weapon|magic weapon]]s, or [[SRD:Creature Spells and Powers#Spells|spells]], with a 50% chance to ignore any damage from a corporeal source. A manifested ghost can pass through solid objects at will, and its own attacks pass through armor. A manifested ghost always moves silently. A manifested ghost can strike with its [[SRD:Touch Attack|touch attack]] or with a ghost touch weapon (see Ghostly Equipment, below). A manifested ghost remains partially on the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]], where is it not [[SRD:Incorporeal|incorporeal]]. A manifested ghost can be attacked by opponents on either the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]] or the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]]. The ghost’s [[SRD:Incorporeal|incorporeal]]ity helps protect it from foes on the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]], but not from foes on the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]].<br/>When a spellcasting ghost is not manifested and is on the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]], its [[SRD:Creature Spells and Powers#Spells|spells]] cannot affect targets on the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]], but they work normally against ethereal targets. When a spellcasting ghost manifests, its [[SRD:Creature Spells and Powers#Spells|spells]] continue to affect ethereal targets and can affect targets on the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]] normally unless the [[SRD:Creature Spells and Powers#Spells|spells]] rely on touch. A manifested ghost’s touch [[SRD:Creature Spells and Powers#Spells|spells]] don’t work on nonethereal targets.<br/>A ghost has two home planes, the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]] and the [[SRD:Ethereal Plane|Ethereal Plane]]. It is not considered extraplanar when on either of these planes. |
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| + | ::Well, what about the aptitude property makes it unquantifiable? I mean, I don't have a copy of the Tome of Battle open in front of me, but, doesn't the property specifically pertain to Weapon Focus? If it does, then I am failing to see anything unpredictable about the feat. If it doesn't then might I ask for a little explination about what would make it unpredictable? I still can't see what would make it so. --[[User:Mock Turtle|Mock Turtle]] 20:33, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | ''Corrupting [[SRD:Gaze|Gaze]] ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]):'' A ghost can blast living beings with a glance, at a range of up to 30 feet. Creatures that meet the ghost’s [[SRD:Gaze|gaze]] must succeed on a [[SRD:Saving Throw|Fortitude save]] or take 2d10 points of damage and 1d4 points of [[SRD:Charisma|Charisma]] damage. |
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| + | :::Well, it's a +1 cost that allows you to use the Weapon Focus / Spec (some other weapon) lines with a weapon that has it on it. Which is opening up the benefit those feats provide, but not substantially so. And if you have those feats for the weapon that the aptitude property is on, the property just turns into an extra +1 hit / damage. So this feat looks really really weak, because you'd have to have all of those lines in the weapon that you would get aptitude on with this feat, and as such get a really minor benefit. So I think I'm missing interesting optimization tricks that the feat language allows, cause this looks like really minor benefit junk that is easily quantified as fighter level. And that's just not TKs style at all. - [[User:Tarkisflux|TarkisFlux]] 22:14, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | ''Horrific Appearance ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]):'' Any living creature within 60 feet that views a ghost must succeed on a [[SRD:Saving Throw|Fortitude save]] or immediately take 1d4 points of [[SRD:Strength|Strength]] damage, 1d4 points of [[SRD:Dexterity|Dexterity]] damage, and 1d4 points of [[SRD:Constitution|Constitution]] damage. A creature that successfully saves against this effect cannot be affected by the same ghost’s horrific appearance for 24 hours. |
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| + | :::: Interesting optimization: Variant Greater Weapon Focus + Blood in the Water + Lightning Mace + Keen Kukris + TWF tree + Iron Power (which stacks, though it's 3.25) gives you a crit range of 9-20 and an extra attack whenever you ''threaten'' a crit, as well as +1 cumulative to attack and damage when you crit. You could do the same with Aptitude Weapon, but this hinges on either that weapon enhancement or this feat in order to allow Lightning Mace to be used with kukris. I... definitely see that as past fighter level. Take away either this feat or the aptitude weapon and it's quickly reduced to near-fighter-ish level of balance. --[[User:Ghostwheel|Ghostwheel]] 22:39, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | ''Malevolence ([[SRD:Special Abilities Overview#Supernatural|Su]]):'' Once per [[SRD:Round|round]], an ethereal ghost can merge its body with a creature on the [[SRD:Material Plane|Material Plane]]. This ability is similar to a ''[[SRD:Magic Jar|magic jar]]'' spell ([[SRD:Caster Level|caster level]] 10th or the ghost’s [[SRD:Hit Dice|Hit Dice]], whichever is higher), except that it does not require a receptacle. To use this ability, the ghost must be manifested and it must try move into the target’s space; moving into the target’s space to use the malevolence ability does not provoke [[SRD:Attacks of Opportunity|attacks of opportunity]]. The target can resist the attack with a successful [[SRD:Saving Throw|Will save]] ([[SRD:DC|DC]] 15 + ghost’s [[SRD:Charisma|Cha]] modifier). A creature that successfully saves is immune to that same ghost’s malevolence for 24 hours, and the ghost cannot enter the target’s space. If the save fails, the ghost vanishes into the target’s body. |
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| + | :::::Can I get a book reference for Blood in the Water and Iron Power? - [[User:Tarkisflux|TarkisFlux]] 22:55, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | <noinclude> |
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| − | {{Author |
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| − | |author_name=Ganteka Future |
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| − | |date_created=1 December 2009 |
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| − | |status=Updated for v7.0 |
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| − | }} |
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| − | <!--Elite Array+Boosts at 4th, 8th to Wisdom, +4 Charisma for Ghost: 13, 14, 12, 10, 17, 8. Feats: Human:Improved Initiative 1st: Bane Attack Focus 3rd: Bane Attack Focus 6th: Bind Possession. Skills: 11 Max ranks. 55 Points.+* for Hide, Listen, Search, Spot for Ghost. HP=6+7+6+7+6+7+6+7 Con(—)=52.--> |
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| + | :::::: Blood in the Water is ToB, level 1 Tiger Claw stance, and Iron Power is in the Book of Vile Darkness, a class ability of the Disciple of Dispater. --[[User:Ghostwheel|Ghostwheel]] 23:04, January 12, 2010 (UTC) |
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| + | :::::::Nitpick - Iron power calls out that it does not stack with the keen property, so you'd need Improved Crit instead. So, TWF, Combat Reflexes, Weapon Focus (light mace), Lightning Mace, Weapon Focus (kukri), Weapon Spec (kukri), Variant Greater Weapon Spec (kukri) or Aptitude kukris, Improved Crit (kukri), Disciple of Darkness, Expertise, Power Attack, and at least 4 levels in a prestige class and 1 level in a ToB class... gets you all of the above but with only a 12-20 crit range (where's that extra modifier coming from?)... it's pretty solid for that cost though, and a good bit of aptitude optimization cheese. I'm not sure that it beats out a spirited charger, though the massive dippage you'd need to make this happen probably broadens your horizons a bit, so I don't know that you'd want to call it 'well' past fighter level. You're still just a melee machine except for other class features you've picked up along the way. |
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| − | ---- |
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| + | |||
| − | {{3.5e NPCs Breadcrumb}} → [[3.5e CR 8 NPCs|CR 10]]<br/> |
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| + | :::::::If the big benefit of it is that you get to do lots of work to allow random weapon style feats to work with rogue level ToB maneuvers I think it's a low rogue or high fighter level on its own, which seems like it would be solidly rogue for you. Especially in light of the fact that it's really all that this feat does since the other benefits you'd normally get from wielding an aptitude weapon are feats that you've already had to take with this weapon to be able to pick it up. Still, it's a very other-stuff dependent feat, so I don't care enough to push the point further. - [[User:Tarkisflux|TarkisFlux]] 00:02, January 13, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | {{3.5e NPCs Breadcrumb}} → [[3.5e ECL 8 NPCs|ECL 10]] |
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| + | |||
| − | [[Category:3.5e]] |
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| + | ::::::::Well, then wouldn't this be better at Rogue level then? --[[User:Mock Turtle|Mock Turtle]] 03:03, January 13, 2010 (UTC) |
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| − | [[Category:User]] |
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| − | [[Category:NPC]] |
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| − | [[Category:CR10]] |
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| − | [[Category:ECL10]] |
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| − | [[Category:Undead Type]] |
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| − | [[Category:Incorporeal Subtype]] |
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| − | [[Category:Chaotic Alignment]] |
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| − | [[Category:Neutral (Good-Evil) Alignment]] |
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| − | </noinclude> |
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Revision as of 03:03, 13 January 2010
Unquantifiable?
I don't get it, this feat is pretty clean and clear cut: it give your weapon the aptitude property. Why is it labelled as "unquantifiable"? --Mock Turtle 19:00, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Because the aptitude quality in itself, I would surmise, is unquantifiable (at least in the tagger's eyes). Looking at it, I can understand that to some extent. Also, if you'll look at the edit summary:
“
Added balance point - depends completely on which other feats you have
”
- If you disagree, feel free to expand on your previous question. -- Jota 19:55, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Well, what about the aptitude property makes it unquantifiable? I mean, I don't have a copy of the Tome of Battle open in front of me, but, doesn't the property specifically pertain to Weapon Focus? If it does, then I am failing to see anything unpredictable about the feat. If it doesn't then might I ask for a little explination about what would make it unpredictable? I still can't see what would make it so. --Mock Turtle 20:33, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Well, it's a +1 cost that allows you to use the Weapon Focus / Spec (some other weapon) lines with a weapon that has it on it. Which is opening up the benefit those feats provide, but not substantially so. And if you have those feats for the weapon that the aptitude property is on, the property just turns into an extra +1 hit / damage. So this feat looks really really weak, because you'd have to have all of those lines in the weapon that you would get aptitude on with this feat, and as such get a really minor benefit. So I think I'm missing interesting optimization tricks that the feat language allows, cause this looks like really minor benefit junk that is easily quantified as fighter level. And that's just not TKs style at all. - TarkisFlux 22:14, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Interesting optimization: Variant Greater Weapon Focus + Blood in the Water + Lightning Mace + Keen Kukris + TWF tree + Iron Power (which stacks, though it's 3.25) gives you a crit range of 9-20 and an extra attack whenever you threaten a crit, as well as +1 cumulative to attack and damage when you crit. You could do the same with Aptitude Weapon, but this hinges on either that weapon enhancement or this feat in order to allow Lightning Mace to be used with kukris. I... definitely see that as past fighter level. Take away either this feat or the aptitude weapon and it's quickly reduced to near-fighter-ish level of balance. --Ghostwheel 22:39, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Can I get a book reference for Blood in the Water and Iron Power? - TarkisFlux 22:55, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Blood in the Water is ToB, level 1 Tiger Claw stance, and Iron Power is in the Book of Vile Darkness, a class ability of the Disciple of Dispater. --Ghostwheel 23:04, January 12, 2010 (UTC)
- Nitpick - Iron power calls out that it does not stack with the keen property, so you'd need Improved Crit instead. So, TWF, Combat Reflexes, Weapon Focus (light mace), Lightning Mace, Weapon Focus (kukri), Weapon Spec (kukri), Variant Greater Weapon Spec (kukri) or Aptitude kukris, Improved Crit (kukri), Disciple of Darkness, Expertise, Power Attack, and at least 4 levels in a prestige class and 1 level in a ToB class... gets you all of the above but with only a 12-20 crit range (where's that extra modifier coming from?)... it's pretty solid for that cost though, and a good bit of aptitude optimization cheese. I'm not sure that it beats out a spirited charger, though the massive dippage you'd need to make this happen probably broadens your horizons a bit, so I don't know that you'd want to call it 'well' past fighter level. You're still just a melee machine except for other class features you've picked up along the way.
- If the big benefit of it is that you get to do lots of work to allow random weapon style feats to work with rogue level ToB maneuvers I think it's a low rogue or high fighter level on its own, which seems like it would be solidly rogue for you. Especially in light of the fact that it's really all that this feat does since the other benefits you'd normally get from wielding an aptitude weapon are feats that you've already had to take with this weapon to be able to pick it up. Still, it's a very other-stuff dependent feat, so I don't care enough to push the point further. - TarkisFlux 00:02, January 13, 2010 (UTC)
- Well, then wouldn't this be better at Rogue level then? --Mock Turtle 03:03, January 13, 2010 (UTC)